[x] Punctuation Fluctuation vs. First Occurrence

I'm bringing the conversation over from:

[www.bandtoband.com] http://www.bandtoband.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9975

Matt wrote:
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It's probably sensible that we rewrite Punc Fluc to use the First Occurrence rule, in that F.O. is a definite verifiable fact. Any other treatment results in arbitrariness.
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I wrote:
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Well, we have a conflict here between two approaches that I think are equally verifiable -- and equally arbitrary. Punc Fluc says we take the "simplest" version that we have, orthographically speaking, as primary. F.O. says we standardize on whatever the earliest known release says.
If we change our policy to say that F.O. rules all, then we'll have to go back and look at a lot of band names, e.g.: MC5 (F.O. = MC-5), Ultravox (F.O. = Ultravox!), TSOL (F.O. = T.S.O.L.), and REM (F.O. = R.E.M.).
Check out the Ultravox ruling way back in Aught Six:
[www.bandtoband.com] http://www.bandtoband.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1460
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I think we might be complicating things. Punctuation Fluctuation as applied to most things isn't going away. That rule deals with band names that drop or add punctuation or other non-letters without changing the underlying words. The default band name under Punctuation Fluctuation is, as BGZ put it, the simplest version of the band name.

We/I may have muddied things by conflating Punctuation Fluctuation and Changing Room 5a, the latter of which recognizes equivalency among different symbols and/or words. (For example, Jackson Five = Jackson 5ive = Jackson 5.) In those cases, the first occurrence should be the default name because all the various occurrences are equivalent and choosing the first one makes our lives easier. Changing Room 5a is what should apply here, not Punctuation Fluctuation.

I personally prefer the BGZ approach of spelling out the words when there is an inconsistency in usage (all the more so because we've done it so many times), but that's obviously a hybrid of the two rules.

Spelling out the word on inconsistent use might not be ideal either. "Cuby + Blizzards" appears as "Cuby & The Blizzards" a couple of times. Using the proposed inconsistency rule, that would default them to "Cuby And The Blizzards" but they never appeared like that anywhere (as far as I could find anyway). So maybe that rule needs some fine-tuning. Like "only default back to the written word only if the band actually released something under that exact name" or something.

OK, so we maintain the two-pronged approach -- one for punctuation variation (where "simplest" is best) and one for other types of name variation (where "first" is best). This gets tricky in the case of ampersands, since they can be classified as punctuation, as discussed here:

[www.bandtoband.com] http://www.bandtoband.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5047

...but "&" works differently from typical punctuation marks, since it represents a word ("and"), which can also be represented by other symbols ("+"). Perhaps we need to treat all of these connectors as equivalent, under Changing Room 5a (as we already do with "And" vs. "With", e.g., Neil Young With/And Crazy Horse). So then we'd need to go back to the ampersand entries and look at which variation occurred first, e.g., making "Simon & Garfunkel" the primary band name.

I agree. I updated Simon & Garfunkel, and any other similar changes can be reported as shambles.

If you strive to be perfect in English writing you should be good in punctuation rules but if it is a common deal for you to miss a coma, this source is indispensable to visit and enhance your skills [edit-it.org] http://edit-it.org/blog/15-punctuation-marks-you-probably-dont-know

Helps to be able to spell comma if you want to be taken seriously and not ridiculed as just another silly spam artist.